Satan: Who is he?

Faite's thread got me to thinking about this. Personally I have my own view on who/what the entity known as Satan really is, so here it goes:

Satan, to me, is an entity created mostly by the collective human mind. To me, Satan is the ammalgamation of a large portion of all the negative emotions, repressed sexuality, and violence man's more primal side craves to display. Why are all these urges/emotions repressed? Simple answer: the christian religion. Now I am not trying to say (in this discussion at least) that this is a bad thing, just that the reason Satan exists is because the christian church inadvertanly created him.

So basically what I am trying to say is: Satan is the embodiment of what all of humanity fears/longs for due to influnce from the Judeo/Christian religions for the past 2000 some years. The reason an entity like Satan has come into being so readily falls into my other theory that if you put enough energy into a belief that belief becomes a reality in some way. The Christian church (IMHO) created this Antagonist called Satan as something to keep their flock in fear and in line. The flock believed willingly, so now you have thousands upon thousands of people constantly thinking about this entity known as Satan, wondering if all the bad things that happen to them are the result of Satan, if Satan is trying to tempt them over here, or trying to change the color of their room to lavender over there (sorry, inside joke lol) and while all these people are constantly throwing these thoughts, these bits of their own energy out into the Universe towards this image....the energy starts to coalesce and take a shape, perhaps even take a life of its own.

So yeah...thats about it <!-- s --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s -->

Now I throw this out to the demons on this forum (or anyone else who's got a theory they want other people to hear) who/what do you think the entity known as Satan is? How do you think it came into being?

Also I want to make one other note, I believe that the entity known as Lucifer is different than the entity known as Satan. Lucifer is the actual fallen angel, while Satan is more of a massive subconsious mental construct <!-- s --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s -->

Standard Personal Belief Disclaimers apply.

No, none of this is Biblical (I'm a Deist - we don't do "bibles" other than the word of God as writ in Nature) and my only source is what I remember.

Lucifer and Satan are indeed different. (Though I'll skip the back story and focus for once.)

"Satan" is Samael's title. I don't believe that he's evil or that he rebelled against God. I believe that he is the angel who was cast out by Michael in the first War. (With Lucifer's leap - NOT Fall - being the second, and the rousting of the Grigori being the third.) Those loyal to him were cast out as well.

Samael did what he did because God asked him to - he was partially created to become this entity (among other things), and when the time came, God asked him if he loved Him enough to fulfill his purpose. Samael, being so loyal and so loving, did as he was asked, even though he knew he would be reviled for it and would cause a rift in Heaven through his choice to serve. (And yes, I believe that angels have free will, if they choose to exercise it. It Samael had told Alaha "no," a different angel would have said "yes," even if this role wasn't part of his original intent.)

I believe that Alaha asked Samael to play this role because humans have free will, and untested faith is faith without strength or foundation. Like all things worth having, I feel that we must work for our convictions, and Samael plays the role of the devil in order to help us do so.

As for the entity described in churches, the evil master of Hell who roasts and torments souls forever, I believe that he's a human construct layered over Samael's being in order to instill fear and therefore gain control of the congregation. We see what we expect to see; we make the devil as terrible as we need him to be to satisfy some inner hunger for horror or to inspire ourselves to believe through fear. I think it's the same instinct that prompts us to look when we drive past car accidents. This doesn't mean that this version of the devil isn't real - I think that it's more than capable of tormenting a soul beyond the point of madness, if that soul allows itself to be tormented.

As a side note, I don't believe that the devil or demons possess human being. I think possessions are performed by enraged ghosts, for lack of a better word.

In my LJ, I wrote a fictionalized version of Alaha asking Samael to assume this role. Here it is if you're interested: http://amariune.livejournal.com/2878.html

I think Satan is more of a personification of human sin. People don't like blaming themselves for the bad things that happen in the world, so instead they blame it on this entity they call Satan and it makes them feel better about the world and about themselves. Satan was created by the church, as a means of control. I happen to think most of the things the church considers works of Satan to actually be perfectly fine. Greed, gluttony, envy, etc... they're all human nature and I'd think supressing human nature can have negative effects.

Lucifer, on the other hand, was a rather nice guy and I have absolutely no idea how people came about with the whole Lucifer=Satan thing. If I were Lucifer, I'd be highly annoyed by the idea. I don't believe in Hell as a place where sinners go when they die for eternal punishment. People say Satan rules over Hell, and since Satan is just human sin, then Hell is just another name for the world they create here.

Our view of Satan agrees with Sahra's, though in less detail. He is the very definition of "devil's advocate" in the Judeo-Christian system, given bad PR by religious leaders who either think they know better than the Word about how people should live, or who just don't get it.

-Svanni

Micah Wrote:People say Satan rules over Hell, and since Satan is just human sin, then Hell is just another name for the world they create here.

random note: Satan is often referred to as the ruler of Earth/Earthly pleasures in Satanic texts. Everything falls back to Evil=Live

you put that much power behind a name, and SOMETHING is going to happen. whether Satan was a sentient being (and Hell an actual plane) before the Bible wrote about him or not doesn't really freaking matter after all the crap the Church pulled on everyone started going down.if he DIDN'T exist, Man created it's own enemy. if he DID exist, Man has given him more power than it was ever going to have if it had existed alone, without all of the willpower, thoughts and beliefs we pumped into that godforsaken name.
i'm not too sure what to make of Satan, as in origins, specifications, details, etc. i DO know that he's given a LOT of credit for Samael's work (see Sahra's post. we both remember the same stuff from back Home) and is supposed to by half hotshot lawyer, half horrendous monster-demon-beast-dragon-thingy the size of texas.
oh, and when i was 12 years old i vowed that, even if it got me thrown into the worst part f Hell, i would punch him in the face. did this BEFORE my Awakening ^^
ROFL

Micah Wrote:If I were Lucifer, I'd be highly annoyed by the idea.

oh, he is. TRUST me.


(odd side note: when typing "demon" up above, my fingers typed "domeon" on accident. anyone recognize that word? or am i being paranoid about a typo again?

Vantalus Wrote:i'm not too sure what to make of Satan, as in origins, specifications, details, etc.

kind of off topic, but oh well: my spiritual sister and I personally think he spends most of his time having sex with all the random dumb people that want to "worship" him. Personally, I feel that he really doesn't give a crap about the human race....he just wants to get laid, which is perfectly understandable when you consider the fact he is the culmination of over 2000 years of repressed sexual desire/deviance. The problem arises when he uses the...well I guess you would say "rock star" status of Lucifer and Samael to get what he wants <!-- s --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s -->

daemonstryke Wrote:kind of off topic, but oh well: my spiritual sister and I personally think he spends most of his time having sex with all the random dumb people that want to "worship" him. Personally, I feel that he really doesn't give a crap about the human race....he just wants to get laid, which is perfectly understandable when you consider the fact he is the culmination of over 2000 years of repressed sexual desire/deviance. The problem arises when he uses the...well I guess you would say "rock star" status of Lucifer and Samael to get what he wants <!-- s --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s -->

XD That is the most awesome theory EVER. I guess that's one way to properly take advantage of your position of power.

Micah Wrote:

daemonstryke Wrote:kind of off topic, but oh well: my spiritual sister and I personally think he spends most of his time having sex with all the random dumb people that want to "worship" him. Personally, I feel that he really doesn't give a crap about the human race....he just wants to get laid, which is perfectly understandable when you consider the fact he is the culmination of over 2000 years of repressed sexual desire/deviance. The problem arises when he uses the...well I guess you would say "rock star" status of Lucifer and Samael to get what he wants <!-- s --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_razz.gif" alt=":P" title="Razz" /><!-- s -->

XD That is the most awesome theory EVER. I guess that's one way to properly take advantage of your position of power.

emphasis on the word "position" bowchikabowwow <!-- s:twisted: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_twisted.gif" alt=":twisted:" title="Twisted Evil" /><!-- s:twisted: -->

Quote:As for the entity described in churches, the evil master of Hell who roasts and torments souls forever

Actually, the bible does not support this theory. It is quite the opposite. I can bring up bible verses if you desire it. (This is all I have to say on the subject for the moment)