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On the concept of multiple heavens
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Post: #1
On the concept of multiple heavens
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2008-02-22 6:29
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Vantalus
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Post: #2
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
As far as i can tell, the multiplicity wasn't so much that there were duplicates of everything...more like...different shadows of the same object when different sources of light hit something, the object being Heaven and all those within, the light being each individuals viewpoint, or energy, or existence, or something else.

sort of like, everyone has their own perspective on the world around them, only in Heaven, that perspective actually had an effect on things, giving Heaven, it's environs and inhabitants a different aspect for each viewpoint. some cases are minute, some are extreme, varying from varying personalities for well-known individuals, to completely altered landscapes. This would explain why so many of us Angelics have different memories of Heaven without actually pointing fingers and saying people are wrong...because NO ONE'S memories are wrong...they simply experienced a different Heaven than others did.

Take the First War, for example. An event so profound that it burned though everyone's perspectives and effected everyone involved...however, because of those perspectives, people saw things differently. Some say that it was Lucifer that stood up and started the rebellion, while others say that it was Samael. some say that the rebel, whoever he was in this perspective, did this out of spite, for no reason, and no one saw it coming...while others believe that the rebel was asked by God to spark things and take the fall on purpose, unbeknown to those who would stand against him and a large population of everyone else.

There's also the very real possibility that our memories are ALL interconnected, but we ONLY REMEMBER WHAT WE EXPERIENCED. maybe those that remember Michael as a ruthless bully only saw that side of him, and those that don't remember Helel and Lucifer being connected never saw the former aspect of the whole being, and were only shown the aspect that falls under the latter name. Maybe those that remember different people starting the War for different reasons were TOLD whatever it is they remember.

Think about it...unless they did research afterwards, do you think any WW2 generation civilian remembers every little detail about WW2? they would only know if they did the research, and as of right now, there's no way for ANY of us incarnated Angelics to truly know the full truth of how things were back home. there's nothing to research...well, there IS, but it's interpreted by men and heavily biased.

So, if not multiple Heavens, then definitely one reason or another for the fact that a lot of people remember things differently, and i refuse to point fingers and say that people are wrong. there's a logical explanation for the differences, be it simple or complex. I can feel it.

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2008-02-22 14:55
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Post: #3
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
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2008-02-22 18:49
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Vantalus
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Post: #4
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
*bows* of course. Sahra and I have tossed this idea back and forth time and time again, and it comes back to me again every now and then. thanks for posting this thread.

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2008-02-22 18:57
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Post: #5
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
As the saying goes - one creature's heaven is anothers hell....
2008-02-23 4:18
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elzebrook
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Post: #6
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
Everyone has their own conception of "heaven" (as in a perfect place), and it differs from all other conceptions. So it's not that there are multiple heavens so much as everyone needs/wants/sees heaven as a different thing. For example, mine is a huge forest with a library. Someone else's is a beach, someone else's is a white city in the clouds, and so on and so forth. All entirely different, all still heaven.

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2008-02-24 4:19
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Post: #7
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
elzebrook Wrote:Everyone has their own conception of "heaven" (as in a perfect place), and it differs from all other conceptions. So it's not that there are multiple heavens so much as everyone needs/wants/sees heaven as a different thing. For example, mine is a huge forest with a library. Someone else's is a beach, someone else's is a white city in the clouds, and so on and so forth. All entirely different, all still heaven.

Not true. I have no concept of heaven. I'd get overwhelmingly bored in any "perfect" place. I need conflict to survive, and conflict is in no way perfect.

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2008-02-24 17:39
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Post: #8
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
Oh C'mon Deros...
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0492.html">http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0492.html</a><!-- m -->

Anyway, on the concept of multiple heavens, I firmly and completely 100% disbelieve that sentiment.

As far as people remembering things differently, remembering people being nice or as bullies, remembering Heaven having a ghetto or anything else wacky we've seen... I think it's flaw on the part of the person.

I believe that the realm of Heaven, is not meant to be paradise for everyone, it is an area, an area called Heaven, that's all. I believe that it is expansive and there are many parts of it, seemingly like completely different planes, but it is all one realm.

For the sake of people seeing things differently, either their own perspective of it is different, for example, I'm a very conservative person, when I hear about the war in Iraq, and I hear why they went in, I think it was a good reason, why we're still there, I think that the papers are lying and that what was said and the reasons are very simple and correct. Someone else however, will see the same events and reasons exceedingly differently.

On the concept of multiples, the thought that there's one Michael who's a prick, one Michael who's a softy, one Michael who wears clown makeup and sounds like Simon Cowell.... I firmly believe people are either perceiving it differently, influenced by this life or are just flat out wrong.

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2008-02-24 21:45
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Post: #9
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
Deros Wrote:
elzebrook Wrote:Everyone has their own conception of "heaven" (as in a perfect place), and it differs from all other conceptions. So it's not that there are multiple heavens so much as everyone needs/wants/sees heaven as a different thing. For example, mine is a huge forest with a library. Someone else's is a beach, someone else's is a white city in the clouds, and so on and so forth. All entirely different, all still heaven.

Not true. I have no concept of heaven. I'd get overwhelmingly bored in any "perfect" place. I need conflict to survive, and conflict is in no way perfect.


Says who? My version of a perfect place could very well have things for me to fight and kill and conflict with. Peace and perfection aren't the same thing.

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2008-02-25 0:29
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Post: #10
Re: On the concept of multiple heavens
Terro Wrote:Oh C'mon Deros...
<!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0492.html">http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0492.html</a><!-- m -->

Anyway, on the concept of multiple heavens, I firmly and completely 100% disbelieve that sentiment.

As far as people remembering things differently, remembering people being nice or as bullies, remembering Heaven having a ghetto or anything else wacky we've seen... I think it's flaw on the part of the person.

I believe that the realm of Heaven, is not meant to be paradise for everyone, it is an area, an area called Heaven, that's all. I believe that it is expansive and there are many parts of it, seemingly like completely different planes, but it is all one realm.

For the sake of people seeing things differently, either their own perspective of it is different, for example, I'm a very conservative person, when I hear about the war in Iraq, and I hear why they went in, I think it was a good reason, why we're still there, I think that the papers are lying and that what was said and the reasons are very simple and correct. Someone else however, will see the same events and reasons exceedingly differently.

On the concept of multiples, the thought that there's one Michael who's a prick, one Michael who's a softy, one Michael who wears clown makeup and sounds like Simon Cowell.... I firmly believe people are either perceiving it differently, influenced by this life or are just flat out wrong.


So, if your saying that there is only one heaven, and its not perfect for all, you then say that there is no "realm of perfection and/or peace" for some?
2008-02-25 21:05
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