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Cause
Amourosa
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Post: #1
Cause
Okay, I know this has great potential to become extremely controversial and get people into trouble, myself included. So, I'm going to ask the question, state why I'm asking the question, then implore you to be civil.

Question: In your *opinion* what causes the condition called "otherkin?" Do you believe there are multiple causes, that some otherkin are otherkin because of one cause and some otherkin are otherkin because of a different cause (aka, psychological vs. reincarnation vs. multiplicity, etc.)?

I ask because I've wanted to know what some theories and hypotheses are for a very long time but was afraid of heated arguments. I'm curious to see some of the ideas that I may not have thought of or read about before. Detailed answers are appreciated.

You can't tell someone their wrong because they believe something, so don't. This is not for you to argue why you're right and someone else is wrong. In all honesty, I've never seen anyone post a positive, indisputable cause for therianthropy, even if you are dead positive you know what it is. I want to know you're OPINION, not why you're right. If the posters here cannot respect these requests and be civil and understanding and openminded of others I will not hesitate to ask a moderator to lock or even remove the thread. This is for calm discussion and idea-sharing, not debate and proving something. Also, please refrain from saying things like, "I don't mean to sound disrespectful." We will assume that, since you are posting here, you are being respectful and you will sound like whatever you sound like. If it's obvious you're not being respectful, bad things will happen.

I understand perfectly if you read this and have a theory but do not want to post it for fear of negative consequences, I'm kind of on that fence, too.

Thank you.

I suppose I should go first. I'm going to admit that I don't really know. As with most things I somehow manage to be of two different opinions. I believe it is spiritual and psychological.
Spiritual: Somehow, the "soul" or "spirit" or "core essence" etc. of a person collects data like a CD (someone else came up with this metaphor, it's not mine but it's brilliant). When the CD is put into use (the core essence is put into a body of some sort, whether physical or not). The state of being otherkin occurs when a person recognizes that the data of their "CD" is other than human.
Psychological: Otherkin-ness likens greatly to a dissociative condition, in my mind. You have the "human side" and the "kin side." I think it could be a condition that has yet to be officially recognized, but it should be noted that a separate personality in Dissociative Identity Disorder *can* be an animal. Why not an angel? Or an elf? Or a dragon? Etc.
Hybrid!: Perhaps, *perhaps* an "Awakened" Otherkin has this dissociative condition due to realizing their "CD" has data other than that of a human's data. Such as a wolf or angel. Maybe you need this "data" and "CD" to realize you are otherkin and develop or recognize a previously unrecognized condition.

Post away! And remember, be nice, or I will ask for the thread to be locked. I'm serious, and I won't hesitate. Please, prove me wrong in worrying so much.

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2009-06-21 16:59
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Post: #2
Re: Cause
Amourosa Wrote:If the posters here cannot respect these requests and be civil and understanding and openminded of others I will not hesitate to ask a moderator to lock or even remove the thread. And remember, be nice, or I will ask for the thread to be locked. I'm serious, and I won't hesitate. Please, prove me wrong in worrying so much.

... it's okay, staff here do keep our eyes on the threads, you know. <!-- sWink --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- sWink --> We'll lock it if we see fit, but we don't delete or remove threads unless it's spam or something like that. That would be an awful shame if there were good points raised here but it had to be deleted because people were fighting. <!-- sSad --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- sSad -->

Amourosa Wrote:I think it could be a condition that has yet to be officially recognized, but it should be noted that a separate personality in Dissociative Identity Disorder *can* be an animal.

To make it even more confusing, psychologists are debating whether 'dissociative identity disorder' really exists. o.O


I think I agree with your 'spiritual' reasoning the most because that's how I've always thought of otherkin. ^^; A CD with different stuff on it inserted into a human - although if you're bringing past lives into it different stuff is added to the CD. It makes a lot of sense to me, I guess. I think I've read that somewhere before, do you know who said it?



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2009-06-21 17:51
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Amourosa
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Post: #3
Re: Cause
momo Wrote:... it's okay, staff here do keep our eyes on the threads, you know. <!-- sWink --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- sWink --> We'll lock it if we see fit, but we don't delete or remove threads unless it's spam or something like that. That would be an awful shame if there were good points raised here but it had to be deleted because people were fighting. <!-- sSad --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- sSad -->

Amourosa Wrote:I think it could be a condition that has yet to be officially recognized, but it should be noted that a separate personality in Dissociative Identity Disorder *can* be an animal.

To make it even more confusing, psychologists are debating whether 'dissociative identity disorder' really exists. o.O


I think I agree with your 'spiritual' reasoning the most because that's how I've always thought of otherkin. ^^; A CD with different stuff on it inserted into a human - although if you're bringing past lives into it different stuff is added to the CD. It makes a lot of sense to me, I guess. I think I've read that somewhere before, do you know who said it?



~ Rizumu

I know you keep an eye on these things Tongue, I just wasn't sure how available you all are. Since I half-expect this to be fairly controversial (who knows, I could be wrong!) I just wanted to make sure people knew I *really* don't want this thread to go down hill. ^__^

Yeah, I've heard of the debate over DID, but they haven't come up with a suitable replacement yet, so this is what I'm going with. Maybe that aspect of otherkin-ness is in that grey area that no one's really explored.

I found it! It took 10 minutes but I finally tracked the original post down. It was Rain in the Becoming An Angel thread. *will now give all credit to Rain for a brilliant analogy*

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2009-06-21 19:24
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Post: #4
Re: Cause
My definition of otherkin explains what I believe rather well...

Otherkin are people who believe themselves to be something other than a human being on a spiritual, psychological, energetic and some even on a biological level, and choose to identify with that non-human fragment of themselves to the point where they count it as a permanent and ingrained part of their personal mythology and/or identity.
_

I consider it possible that "all" otherkin are a result of the human psychology, myself included, but I choose to believe that spiritual reasons are one of the main causes for otherkin to exist.
I doubt any and all claims to biological otherkinism, but I included them because people still believe in it.

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2009-06-21 19:36
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Post: #5
Re: Cause
I'm pretty fond of Miniar's definition. But I have to admit that while I recognize that people hold psychological explanations for their kinship, but I'm most fond of the spiritual explanation...that otherkin are whatever soul (or souls) in a human body.

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2009-06-21 20:02
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Post: #6
Re: Cause
I'm a metamodelist, so frankly, if there is another theory that can make sense, I'll entertain it during specific circumstances.

So that means I sometimes entertain/believe in the spiritual models, which can include Reincarnation in a wide variety of forms. The most commonly used form in the west, that an objective and self-contained Soul moves from body to body. A more Vajrayanic perspective, that there is no objective Soul, or even if there is, that memories, abilities, drives, and personality don't have to incarnate with the Soul (if there is one), meaning people may not be a Dragon, but have the Karma (real Karma, not the West's Karma-light) of a Dragon, or just the memories of a Dragon. Particle reincarnation. Etc.

Psychologically Otherkin can just be the mind finding an appropriate symbol set to understand itself through. As I've told people, if there were some way to properly disprove my nature as a Rakshasa on a spiritual level, I would still call myself a Rakshasa, because other than Rakshasa, there is only one label that is more suiting for me, and that's Ges. It's not so much about DID (though I'll include that a possibility), but that in order to take all the disparate parts of a personality and make sense of them, the mind finds/creatures a mythological model that fits it the best and identifies as that. It's how our minds work. We constantly see characters in books, and movies, or people in real life, and identify with and compare ourselves too, Otherkin could be the same thing playing out.

It can also be imprinting and cryptomnesia, being exposed to dogs as a young child, and documentaries on wolves and canines, can imprint the behaviours and patterns of a canine (at least as understood by a human) into the mind, which can then later be explored and understood as part of the identity.

Cybermodels (though this also fits in Energy models), it could be that someone's mind operates on the same "wavelength" as a specific being (not just a Wolf, but Greg the wolf in Alaska) and as such there is a connection between their minds, as they are in resonance. So it's not so much that Kin are objectively what they think, but they're just resonating with a specific being by fluke, and taking that idea into their identity (and somewhere there is a really ineffectual demon who is resonating with a human). Meaning (I'll pick on Miniar as he is the only poster so far that I know what he is, without having to go back a page and look at his profile), that Miniar's consciousness has a specific note, and somewhere there is a Rakshasa that has the same consciousness note or one really close, and like two tuning forks, they are just resonating off of each other, two forks, one noise.

Biological theories, can range from "Elves were real, and I'm part elf" to notions of atavistic patterns left in our hindbrain, which if activated we'd identify with creatures we consider appropriate (even if they aren't).

Frankly, while I lean toward a Soul Model, I think it would be foolish to discount the others. I mean, just because some souls came from elsewhere, doesn't mean Jimmy didn't watch too much Jurassic Park, and now is some reptilian/dinosaur/dragon kin, or that Maria, just by virtue of being artistic and regal identifies with Elves (even if it is purely symbolic and she's not aware of it), or that Liz isn't thinking he is an Angel, just because he shares a similar energetic "note" to an Angel, and they are picking up each other. Etc.

I can't remember the exact quote, so I'll just create my own. "If you can only understand the phenomena from one perspective, you don't understand the phenomena."

I think there is great value not just in having a theory about things like Otherkin, but being able to intellectually entertain other theories, just to see what impact that has on the object in question, or other parts of your reality.

(Yes, a post from Ges...depending on how swamped my life gets, there may or may not be more coming up again...hopefully earlier in the evening when I'm more coherent and trust my grammar better)

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2009-06-22 4:24
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Post: #7
Re: Cause
For me I believe it's mostly spiritual though not reincarnation wise. I think that souls, or maybe the more acurate term is astral or subtle body, is something other then human. I won't rule out the physical definition. Why? With all of the stories in history of things like dragons, unicorns, merpeople (in fact some credible people in modern day have reported seeing merpeople), fairies, and other things it seems to me that they were and are real.

What happened to all of these mythic beings if they were real though? I believe that they exist in the astrals and in the past the astrals and physical were blended together, maybe not completely but enough that there was interaction. Think of it like oil and vinegar or oil and water. You can blend them but they will eventually separate. That is probably what happened in the past and those that had enough human in them and living a human life stayed with the physical realm when it separated from the astral realm.

I know that I probably went off topic there but I felt like I needed to say it.


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2009-06-22 7:27
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Post: #8
Re: Cause
Amourosa Wrote:Yeah, I've heard of the debate over DID, but they haven't come up with a suitable replacement yet

Even if they do it'll probably still be really controversial because everyone's case is different. You have healthy multiples and then you have multiples who need therapy and help. But the whole 'multiple' thing is another thing altogether, I should be staying on topic~ XD

Quote:I found it! It took 10 minutes but I finally tracked the original post down. It was Rain in the Becoming An Angel thread. *will now give all credit to Rain for a brilliant analogy*

Oh, good! ^o^ I knew I read it before!



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2009-06-22 14:08
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Post: #9
Re: Cause
Miniar Wrote:My definition of otherkin explains what I believe rather well...

Otherkin are people who believe themselves to be something other than a human being on a spiritual, psychological, energetic and some even on a biological level, and choose to identify with that non-human fragment of themselves to the point where they count it as a permanent and ingrained part of their personal mythology and/or identity.

I also like and agree with Min's definition, although I'd like to add "metaphorical" in there as well. Some people might identify more with a metaphorical-reasoning or symbolic-reasoning behind their being Otherkin. I don't know of anyone personally, but I thought it should be included too.

However for me, it's not so much the cause as to the just living it. Granted, I'm always going to try and figure out why or how this happened for me, but I doubt I'll ever have a 100% correct answer so I'd prefer to focus more on just being a therian and experiencing it for what it is.

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2009-06-22 20:05
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Post: #10
Re: Cause
I find that otherkin just are, sure there are technical terms, opinions, ideas etc, as to why otherkin appear, but quite frankly there are probably a number of different reasons as to why otherkin exist, and I'll admit for the longest time I've always used the term 'Non-Terran' in reference to what everyone else on this thread calls 'Otherkin', and I still do. Either way, for me otherkin/non-terran's just are, there is no technical explanation for myself because I personally don't see one.

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2009-06-23 5:54
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